Don’t copy the behavior and customs of this world, but let God transform you into a new person by changing the way you think. Then you will learn to know God’s will for you, which is good and pleasing and perfect.Romans chapter 15, verse 2; from the New Living Translation
You know, I thought I was through writing about the mess in the United Methodist Church. This was because I am no longer a United Methodist pastor. Yet, 48 years of service to the United Methodist Church compels me to pray for the United Methodist Church. But write about it? No way, Jose`! One would think that since the “divorce” is final for many former congregations and pastors, the words about us wanting to leave would be over. Apparently, some think differently than me. Even a friend and brother in Christ. Ron seems to think more needs to be said.
So, I am speaking only to United Methodists who are in the discernment phase and to those who think that as traditionalists they can stay in the United Methodist Church. And from the comments made on Ron’s post and similar posts, there is a prevalent mean and ugly spirit within those remaining United Methodists. He is Ron’s post. I am concealing his last name for obvious reasons.
Let me speak into this statement first: “How many Pastors drove this hatred of the UMC into their congregations?!” OK, Ron, tell us. What was that number of pastors who drove their hated of the United Methodist Church? Was it 1? 5? 25? 50? Of the 198 congregations that disaffiliated December 10, was it 100 pastors? I’m waiting, Ron. And before you give me a number, cite your research and sources.
Let’s look at the next statement: “I’m not convinced that all those members had the desire to leave the UMC.“ OK, Ron. There was a 3 month clearly defined process and procedure. It included first and foremost, prayer. In fact, the entire process was to be covered in prayer. Are you saying those 198 congregations didn’t pray? Refused to pray? This process also required to hear from those who were staying in the United Methodist Church. And the last step was a Church Conference where all full members were allowed to be present and allowed to vote. The percentage required to approve disaffiliation was set at 67% in favor. Did the District Superintendent mislead the congregation on how they needed to vote? Was there collusion in counting the votes? Was there a conspiracy within the Conference Board of Trustees to just get rid of those 198 congregations? If their desire was to stay United Methodists, then why did the outcome of those 198 congregations say otherwise? Again, Ron. I’m waiting for your answer.
Now, let’s take on this next statement: “I blame their Pastors. I feel as if they indoctrinated their people.” So, Ron, it’s their pastor’s fault? Really? Are you saying that laypersons are incapable of forming their own opinions and making their own decisions? Hummmm. Interesting, Ron. I wonder how those laypersons feel about your statement? I wonder if they would agree with your personal assessment that they were incapable of making a factual decision. Or, perhaps, you have documentation to prove your allegation? Pastors have a difficult enough time to implement a simple change with just a simple majority. But a 67% majority? My experiences would find that hard to believe. I know your statement said “I feel as if”, but tell me, Ron, when did your feelings become facts? I’m still waiting for your answer.
Then you said, “It’s painful to let 198 congregations go in one day, not to mention all those Pastors who just quit and gave up their orders. It pains me to see so many of my colleagues just leave our Church.” To your credit, half of your statement is true. It is “painful to let 198 congregations go in one day”. And I wholeheartedly agree with you. But did you ever consider that it was painful for many of them, too? I have witnessed the pain of laypersons who made this decision. They are convinced it is where God is leading them–but it’s painful for them, too. Or is it that their pain doesn’t matter? Or is it your pain is larger and more important than their pain? Still waiting for your reply.
But the other half of your statement simply isn’t true: “not to mention all those Pastors who just quit and gave up their orders“! Just as congregations went through a discernment process, so have we pastors. I, and my fellow sisters and brothers have determined that God is leading us in another direction. And in an act of integrity, we must surrender our credentials. It’s what the current Book of Discipline mandates. We are not quitting, we are following! Following the requirements of the Book of Discipline. But more important–we are following Jesus to where He is leading us. If Jesus is leading you to stay in the United Methodist Church, then be faithful to Jesus, Ron. No one is accusing you of not following Jesus. I cannot tell you what Jesus wants you to do anymore than YOU can tell us what Jesus wants us to do when it comes to the United Methodist Church. I hate to think this, but you give the impression of arrogance. We haven’t given up. Just because you say we’ve given up doesn’t mean we have. In case you haven’t figured it out–sometimes it costs us dearly when following Jesus. At 66 years old, I could have simply retired, and kept my United Methodists orders. But God is leading me in a different direction. I’m not asking nor expecting you to like it–however it is reasonable to expect from you my friend and brother in Christ, to respect my decision.
And one last statement you made and I do not know if you thought about how it sounds: I say to those 198 congregations, “Go ahead and Leave, do whatever it is you need to do. We will continue to stand in the light of God and do our part to spread God’s Kingdom! This will not stop and Jesus will be our guide and Lord!” Ron, I hope and pray you will continue to stand in the light of God. Know what, Ron? We who left are going to continue to stand in the light of God and do our part to spread God’s Kingdom, too. Is that so hard for you to comprehend? Surely you are not so–what’s the word–presumptuous as to think we are incapable of making the same decision! Are you? That’s not the Ron I met and thought was my brother in Christ and friend.
You ended your post with these words: “May our tempers be calm, God’s grace prevail, and by the mercy of the Holy Spirit help us all to move forward.” By us all, do you mean US ALL–or just United Methodists? Ron, if you are just frustrated, I can relate to that. But the accusations you made against 198 congregations and us pastors–well it doesn’t sound like moving forward, it doesn’t sound calm, and it certainly isn’t grace-filled words. Contrary to your statements, I am capable of listening to God and following Him where He wants me to go. Your words, my friend, didn’t form my decision. However, they did confirm I made the right decision.
So, to current United Methodists who are traditionalists/conservatives that think there’s room for you in the United Methodist Church–I can’t tell you what to do. But know that the voice of my friend isn’t the only voice offering ugly words and a lack of grace. You are held in contempt until you agree with progressives. If you can live like that, then by all means, stay United Methodist. I am not abandoning the United Methodist Church. I’m not quitting the United Methodist Church. I am following Jesus, Ron. I’m follow Jesus–even if you think I’m not!
5 thoughts on “AND IT JUST GETS UGLIER!”
Thank you Randy! Well written full of grace and truth. Unlike what was written.
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The writer who you comment on has been my pastor in the past. I also believe that most of his commentary stated here is unfortunate. The one area that I do think he is someone correct about is the influence of pastors on their congregations, but I would say that would be the case whether they are staying UMC or disaffiliating. I truly believe that the whole process of disaffiliating has been a makeshift mess that needed more uniformity and organization across jurisdictions before any decision to stay or leave was considered. And the concept regularly mentioned by BeUMC folks that there does not need to be a vote at all (meaning pastors need to discourage any mention of leaving) is just truly astonishing to me–why wouldn’t you allow the congregation itself to make the decision of the most momentous question for each church in over 100 years? Why would that question be up to a pastor that is likely going to be gone in 5-6 years??
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EC, lest we forget, this whole disaffiliation process would not have been “such a mess” if the original supporters of the Protocol had not broken their promise to follow through on their support and there wasn’t a quickly closing window in which to accomplish it.
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Brother Randy, full disclosure here. Although I’ve not been a member of a UMC congregation over the last decade, I’ve been an active participant in a local church. I’d been watching during this period to see if the denomination could redirect itself from its progressive lunge to the direction of secular leftist political policies, before officially joining. From my previous experience within the ELCA, I could predict where this was likely to end. Sad to say, my hunch was right. I believe that we both frequent Brother Ritter’s blog site. As you know he’s been keeping up with this whole process. It’s not unusual to read posts over there written by progressives that constantly misconstrue the positions of traditional orthodox believers. My guess is that your friend who’s post that you’re commenting on is someone who spends a lot of time within the progressive “echo chamber “ of social media. His reference to the so-called Wesleyan Quadrilateral leads me to believe that he’s one of those people who’ve been seduced into believing that we have the authority to reinterpret Scripture in such a way to make it fit easier within the current Zeitgeist of our culture. Yes, praying is about the only option we have, only God can open they’re eyes to the truth.
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This is so sad to me, and I wonder, who’s leaving whom? In my opinion, progressives are the ones leaving the Truth. Since only the Lord can change hearts and minds, maybe it’s time to stop arguing and just pray for them.
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